User talk:Neil Conley

Hi Neoconned, I like the idea of being able to supplement words decribing complex relationships with a diagram. I had a look at your sample a few days back and thought it was great. I guess my only comments from an editorial side would be: a) if we instal the graph capacity we'll need to create some help pages to explain how it works and is edited; and b) I'll think a little more about what the best system for checking diagrams for accuracy might be - referenced words are easier to cross check but still important diagrams are right. cheers --Bob Burton 16:42, 24 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Hi Bob, glad you like the idea. As regards (a), obviously I'm happy to contribute to such help pages. As regards (b), I'll be interested to see what you come up with! --Neoconned 21:00, 25 Apr 2005 (EDT)

Clickable Nodes

Thanks for the heads up, by the way, Neoconned; Graphviz supports clickable nodes natively, and it shouldn't be a problem to script it up. Peter Danenberg 02:55, 4 May 2005 (EDT)

Redirects

Tks for the suggestion. I tried http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Israel&redirect=no but all that happened was I got bounced to Wikipedia before I could do anything. So I tried Hugh's suggestion of http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Israel&action=edit and that opened the page so I could delete the redirect.

But on the general point I agree such redirects are useless. Any ideas on what would be the best way to search for any others lurking in SW that only contain a redirect to Wikipedia? I'd like to get rid of the lot of them. cheers --Bob Burton 05:39, 23 May 2005 (EDT)

Agree with Bob

... admit at times to being guilty of using these redirects to the Wikipedia although it appeared to be "the way it was done" if the Wikipedia seemed to have a topic well covered ... will make a concerted effort now to refer to the Wikipedia either directly below the subject line on a new article page (if there is no other information to add at the time) or in the External Links section when appropriate, particularly since there are several other wiki pedias out there (i.e. the dKosopedia). Artificial Intelligence 05:53, 23 May 2005 (EDT)

National Missile Defense

• Linked as many articles as I could recall to the category.
• Launched a stub to connect the topic (US) to the category.

Hope this helps ... saw this one coming long ago Artificial Intelligence 13:41, 28 May 2005 (EDT)

Thanks AI. I was surprised when I realized there was no central SW article on this topic. For the UK, it's another glorious and national-pride-enhancing opportunity for us to provide political cover to George Bush. --Neoconned 13:46, 28 May 2005 (EDT)

SQL dump

Hi, N. I got your message about the problem with the MySQL dump. Just this week we finally hired a webmaster, and I'll have her take care of this. (I'm trying to transition myself out of webmaster duties as quickly as possible, and this will be a good opportunity for her to learn some of the details involved in administering SourceWatch.) It may take a couple of days for her to get around to this, but we should have it for you by next week at the latest. --Sheldon Rampton 01:34, 10 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Thanks, Sheldon. --Neoconned 06:18, 10 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Hi, N. The SQL dump is complete... you can download it at:

Tricia

--Patricia Barden 13:03, 21 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Hi Tricia. First, congratulations on and best of luck in your new job! Thanks for sorting out the database backup. (BTW there's a minor error in the link you gave, which I've fixed). I tried downloading the backup, but it seems to be cutting out at about 51MB, although the claimed size of the backup is 95MB. I tried twice - once using Firefox's download manager, and once using the freeware Xi download manager. Both cut out at around but not exactly the same file size. (I'm getting a download speed of about 250KB/sec so trying again is no great sweat!) I don't think it's a timeout problem at my end, since I get more or less the same behaviour from two different download managers. Any ideas? --Neoconned 10:51, 22 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Hi, N. Thanks for the well wishes! I'm going to do a another dump, compress the file, and email it to you. It would be helpful if you could add your email address to your user information on SourceWatch.

--Patricia Barden 12:52, 23 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Hi Tricia. I've managed to download it ok now, thanks. I discovered that for some reason, I can resume the download (in Xi download manager) by disconnecting and reconnecting my ADSL connection once the download stalls. No idea why, but it works! --Neoconned 23:43, 23 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Hi, N. Because of possible security issues associated with the SQL dump file, we are temporarily removing the link. If, in the future, you need a copy of this file, please email bob AT sourcewatch.org and we'll send one to you.

--Patricia Barden 00:07, 24 Aug 2005 (EDT)

IFF's

Actually just had a quick look - looks fine. I'll drop the person who queried the entry a note mentioning updating. cheers --Bob Burton 08:10, 18 Jun 2005 (EDT)

Re Satire and sarcasm in SW articles

Perhaps you'd like a helping hand .. I'm sure that making SW PC will keep us both busy for some time.

The use of the strikeout device in Peace Vigil in Crawford, Texas was a direct quote ... thanks for editing the author's original wording. I'm sure he'd be pleased.

Artificial Intelligence 13:47, 18 Aug 2005 (EDT)

BTW .. the slam on "palatial ranch" is on the fact that it used to be a pig farm ... and the protesters were sitting in a ditch ...

Hi AI, OK I now see what happened there. However, there was absolutely nothing to indicate to the reader that the bulleted list was a direct quotation from Raw Story. The reader shouldn't have to follow a reference to determine whether the content of a paragraph is a direct quotation, a paraphrasing, or original content. If content is copied verbatim from an external site, as in this case it was, that fact should be clearly indicated by quotation marks, and preferably an explicit preamble.

My concern is not about whether SW is PC or not. It's about trying to make sure articles are written in an appropriate style. Articles should not read like personal blog entries. --Neoconned 14:09, 18 Aug 2005 (EDT)

Might I ask a favor? Perhaps the next time you think that something I have written resembles a "personal blog entry", please contact me directly and ask me about it before deleting or editing the entry. I will gladly tweak the entry to correct it appropriately. Artificial Intelligence 14:26, 18 Aug 2005 (EDT)

But AI, the point is you didn't write that section. You copied it verbatim from an external blog, without indicating that fact to the reader. The section certainly read as if you had written it, and nearly all readers will have assumed that. But you hadn't written it.

This is a wiki. We're not supposed to have to ask each other for permission before making changes to articles! That said, I nearly always refrain from making changes to articles I haven't had much involvement with. However, if any one of us sees something that he/she thinks is inappropriate for SW, I think it's important to do something about it. Furthermore, I took the trouble to explain my edit to you straightaway. --Neoconned 14:40, 18 Aug 2005 (EDT)

---

You on a new email address? Just got a bounced message. Drop me a line if you have a new one - otherwise might just be a server down. cheers --Bob Burton 22:07, 24 Nov 2005 (EST)

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Thanks -- I agree. No way of know what the origin of ther material is. --Bob Burton 15:21, 13 Dec 2005 (EST)

--- tks for the typo catch -- got distracted. --Bob Burton 02:56, 27 Jan 2006 (EST)

-- re referencing mention - I agree. I started revamping the Help pages the other day and want to include a section on referencing. --Bob Burton 23:38, 8 Feb 2006 (EST)

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help bar NICE! Thank you!

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Hi, Neo. Interesting idea for the navbar. I've got a question, though: Won't it be hard to maintain? For example, you've got an offset of 186 for categories that begin with "R." (I think the actual offset should be 185.) But won't the offsets change every time someone adds a new category?

There are some schemes for adding navigation at MediaWiki extensions. I haven't tested them to know how well they work, but if you're interested in getting something added to SourceWatch, I could have you talk with our webmaster. --Sheldon Rampton 13:58, 14 Mar 2006 (EST)

Re, "recurring": I just mean that it's a page that recurs on every page of the entire website and therefore should be protected so that only sysops can edit it. Otherwise it becomes an attractive target for vandals. --Sheldon Rampton 14:02, 14 Mar 2006 (EST)

Thanks for info on citations

Thanks. Keep me posted as things evolve. (Answered here, rather than at thread, so you would know I had received your detailed explanation.--Beth Wellington 23:17, 15 Mar 2006 (EST)

Wilson Research Associates

Actually Wikipedia requires references too. Mine are in the body, but didn't have time tonight to add a reference section due to library closing. they print out when you print the article. If you want to add them tonight fine, otherwise I will add them tomorrow. --Beth Wellington 01:13, 10 Apr 2006 (EDT)

Thank you for the example. I don't have time to get it up to snuff tonight but will work on it. I had seen many other articles on Sourcewatch with no footnotes leading back to the organization's site. For example, see Capital Research Center's National Advisory Board.--Beth Wellington 20:07, 11 Apr 2006 (EDT)

Hi Neoconned - I've moved and replied to your comments to me on my page as they are addressed to me and cover a number of issues. Best - --Ben Malcom

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re upload verification

You wrote: Hi AI,

Could you please do me a favour? Could you check the following screengrabs which I previously uploaded to SW:

• Image:AsiaPacificFoundationOrganisationPage29July2005.jpg
• Image:GohelAPFBulletinSept2001-DownloadedJuly2005-ScreengrabTakenMay2006.png

against these pages which have for some reason survived in the cache of one particular Google server:

• http://66.249.93.104/search?q=cache:-grHvv9cI0UJ:www.apfoundation.org/articles-agra.htm+site:apfoundation.org+vision&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=2
• http://66.249.93.104/search?q=cache:bef2QH2oo6AJ:www.apfoundation.org/organisation.htm+site:apfoundation.org+organisation&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1

Please also use this NSLOOKUP to verify that the server in question is really a Google one: http://www.zoneedit.com/lookup.html?ipaddress=66.249.93.104&server=&reverse=Look+it+up

Having done so, if you think that the screengrabs are accurate and non-fraudulent, could you please sign both Image pages (which can be edited like any other article) with a statement to that effect. User:Ben Malcom has challenged their authenticity, so I'd like to establish this beyond doubt.

Many thanks, --Neoconned 00:31, 8 May 2006 (EDT)

Neoconned:

As for the authenticity of the screen grabs, Hugh Manatee is the better qualified to understand how to, well, authenticate .... on the other hand,

• Using Network Solutions "Whois" search: See http://www.networksolutions.com/whois/results.jsp?whoistoken=0

OrgName: Google Inc.

OrgID: GOGL

Address: 1600 Amphitheatre Parkway

City: Mountain View

StateProv: CA

PostalCode: 94043

Country: US

NetRange: 66.249.64.0 - 66.249.95.255

Artificial Intelligence 04:10, 8 May 2006 (EDT)

What on earth do you mean by telling a fellow syop to “stop vandalising the pages”? This kind of comment is arrogant and impertinent. Thus far, I have tried to be polite in my messages to you as everyone can see. I actually called you a respected member. Your response, with respect, is quite hysterical, as also rude, and you totally fail to grasp the essentials.

It would have been nice if you let me know you had replied to me instead of putting it on another page. Other than you, for the second time. no one has questioned my integrity.

The fact that you go to bizarre and extreme lengths to discover and locate old outdated, and not crucially significant information, as also not to allow any edit, will suggest to some that you have strong personal issues, or involvement, and this is harmful to the entire SW project.

I am sorry to repeat this but just a brief glance of your comments displays an obsessive and conspiracy-type mindset over basically trivial issues. An example of this is your assertion that I along with others appeared to conveniently materialise spontaneously to change a web page.

I would not be made a syop if I focused on one page. You accuse me of showing “disproportionate interest” but you conveniently ignore the fact that my last edit was 9 months ago on that issue.

Ask respected members like AI, Hugh, and Bob what I’ve been doing over the last many months. I’ve set up new pages on all kind of issues, and unlike you I have allowed others to edit and contribute.

The views of others have to be respected. I regret to say you are the only one that is obsessive, you have turned these pages into your personal blogs. No one is allowed to make any edits, you don’t allow it as if its your own private page. My edits were fair and were devoid of any agenda. I have neither praised nor criticised, nor made innuendoes.

I never accused you or anyone of forgery as you want to imply and allege. My point, an obvious one surely, was that impartial observers may judge screen grabs supplied from the personal computers of anonymous SW contributors as being of doubtful provenance. What is rude about that? If you had authentic links you should have put them in before.

You are willing to be rude and offensive to me, yet any comment about a local regional south asian newspaper you immediately condemn as “patronizing and offensive”. Unless you have a very strong regional interests or affiliations I cannot understand your reaction. In any case, my original point still stands, Excelsior chose a selective headline in their own regional interests which you then jumped on. There is no comparison between the reputable Yorkshire Post and the Excelsior, and I don’t think that needs any further comment.

Again, on the Agra point, you expose some kind of personal regional interest. The article was about the peace summit between two leaders and nothing else, and you then selected a quote to attack one of the summit leaders, on an issue not connected with that summit.

You have taken many things totally out of context, indulge in manipulative and selective editing, imply conspiracies, zealously refuse to consider any other SW member edit, and it is this kind of tilted approach which does no justice to SW’s policy of fairness and accuracy. As far as your other points, I have not deleted anything. I have merely made edits to make SW pages look more respectable, and away from your blog type edits. Some things could go in to the APF talk page but do not belong on the main page.

I have to say that it is your approach which is tantamount to “vandalism.” Whatever your personal connections may or may not be to the region or the APF in the past, please kindly refrain from using SW for your own agenda. I am restoring the pages. --Ben Malcom

Asia Pacific Foundation

Neoconned, I'm trying to see if I can mediate this dispute a bit. Please see the Talk:Asia-Pacific Foundation page. You and Ben Malcom are both great contributors to SW and I hate to see you two get bogged down in this stuff.

Best, Conor Kenny, Congresspedia Editor

Neoconned,

Bob indicates that the thing over the APF has died down. Can I do anything further on this or should we let sleeping dogs lie?

--Conor Kenny

Hi Conor, Thanks - I don't think there's anything further that needs doing. For now, I'm adding new material to the talk pages, in order to give any other interested parties a chance to raise objections. If I don't hear any objections i'll move it across sometime in the next few weeks. Some of the new material actually addresses Ben Malcom's complaints - for example i've found additional sources for the section on the APF's founding conference. Cheers, --Neoconned 19:36, 19 May 2006 (EDT)

Stan-Ley

I live in the constituency of Jim Murphy, I've got to say what a good job you've done in researching him. I've added a link, I hope you don't mind. Having had a look at your page what is interesting is that The ID cards stuff that you have put in is also very current as is the nuclear power factor. There are so many new issues to add to that. One final point, I used to work in the NHS and lets say I don't anymore!! so you are covering some key areas. - Stan-Ley

Scots issues intrest me. He supported the Iraq Suppliers, did not mind ward closures etc.- Stan-Ley

Oops! tks! - Stan-Ley

Riggs Bank

The Symington connection leads to some pretty interesting stuff. Artificial Intelligence 09:02, 16 May 2006 (EDT)

James W. Symington, Attorney O'Connor & Hannan L.L.P.

• "A former Director of the ... the Riggs National Bank, Blair House ..."

• Riggs Bank, NNDB.com.
• Chief of Protocol, Dept of State.

ANSWER Yes, the Symingtons are all related, including former AZ Gov. Fife Symington who was indicted, I believe. They appear to be another Bush-like dynasty, Yale, warts, boils, and all. I came across a ref for Fife and Air CIA but have not followed up. Have fun! Artificial Intelligence 10:55, 16 May 2006 (EDT)

Rendition Flights

Posted some loose data on some more flights ... format away! Artificial Intelligence 15:35, 16 May 2006 (EDT)

More

• Air America
• Aero Contractors in the Wikipedia.

Florida Corp Searches

See: http://www.dos.state.fl.us/doc/

Yes, you are correct. I saw the comment section in "Recent changes" you made after a posting but had not checked the article page itself. Just trying to be helpful. Artificial Intelligence 07:51, 18 May 2006 (EDT)

Those Florida files

Hi Neoconned, I have captured and uploaded those Florida files as pdfs and added links into the article page. cheers --Bob Burton 19:17, 20 May 2006 (EDT)

Thanks, Bob. --Neoconned 10:11, 21 May 2006 (EDT)

Message from Rcooley

Neoconned, I would greatly appreciate it if you could be honest with me and to all other contributors and reveal your identity. I suspect you used to work in our office but your services were terminated after it was found that you had pornographic images of children. This is not the best way to gain revenge. We can talk about whatever problems you may have. User:Rcooley

What a laughably transparent smear. No, I am not that individual, even supposing that individual ever existed (since in all likelihood you just made up the story about a disgruntled former employee). Let's talk about the problem you have. It is that you can't find a single inaccuracy in the articles. You therefore have to resort to these childish tactics. I've been contributing to SourceWatch for two years now, and have only recently started writing about Tepper Aviation, Inc. I have absolutely no connection with Tepper. The reason i'm writing about them is that I believe, as do many others, that their antics are bad for America, bad for democracy, bad for my country, and just plain wrong. --Neoconned 22:27, 22 May 2006 (EDT)

Neo, I think if I remember correctly that is how you used to like to be called. I’m appealing for you to stop your agenda of revenge. I think if you can be honest with us for just one minute, you know you were the one who had child pornography photos on your computer. I thought we resolved that. I can still help you overcome this problem but this is not the way forward.

Don’t talk to me about democracy or about feeble smears. We have been fighting to ensure democracy remains part of our constitution before you and the rest of the X-Files crew turned up. You can add as many new links and pages as you want for Tepper but you won’t prove a thing nor will you find anything of substance because it does not exist. We’ll be in touch with you soon. Before I forget, how is the cat?

ATT/NSA Data available

ATT/NSA Docs published by Wired News

Evan Hansen, Why We Published the AT&T Docs", Wired News, May 22, 2006

--hugh_manateee 23:43, 22 May 2006 (EDT)